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Topic: Xenophobia at ALIPAC (.US) (Read 25681 times)
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bob1388
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Bob,
btw, did you see what W said about you<?
NoYouCannot,
Your first mistake was giving a rats butt what Bob had to say in the first place.
You can't trust a word Bob says about anything. I know that a lot of our people are open minded and willing to give people a fair chance, but that fairness on our part is often exploited by those willing to lie and pretend they know things that they don't.
Don't feel bad, when he first contacted me with serious accusations about ALIPAC I fully investigated them as I would want to do for anyone that might have a legitimate concern.
It was all BS and everything he claimed fell apart under the slightest bit of scrutiny.
He is relying that some people will accept his claims as valid merely because he saying things.
Anyone willing to look into what he says quickly discovered that he is a profuse and consistent liar.
I'm glad he is working for the other side. He's actually providing us with a great service to be revealed at a later date.
W
You know, what is really apalling is W saying he investigated my claims, but in my last e-mail I told him I was putting together samples for him, and a short time later, before I ever got back to him, he booted me with a rather nasty e-mail. Now how can he thoroughly investigate something if I haven't provided the evidence yet?
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MichaelC45
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lol........... this is quite funny ........... made my night lol
Sorry bob I didn't mean you lol I was answering another post lol
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Dee
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Good for you Bob for staying so strong.
MC and his Alipac crew are what they are.
So sad.
To bad.
Someone should give them a course in debating.
Maybe it would help them.
Here is a good link for them:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Debate
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iamme
Global Moderator
Hero Member
Posts: 1012
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Thank you Lamme, I appreciate the comment. MC is a terrible poster. He printed Tony´s personal information on the Alipac.com website for ALL to see. It was terrible. I was just appalled. Then he comes here and tried to pretend he was not so blatant. He is very mischievious. Please be careful of him. PS: I like your website. But please be careful of those ANTI websites like ALIPAC.org. They are loaded with xxx Hello everyone and a hearty WELCOME to Michael. I hope you find yourself at home here where you can express your sentiments.
First off, this is Alipac.net, not Alipac.org, and both Alipacs have different acronyms, which means, technically, there is no copyright fringe. Unless Alipac is a registered trademark, that's a different story, but even so, one would have to use the exact Alipac logo in order for there to be legal charges.
Secondly, I am advicing everyone to tone it down or I am going to have to start deleting all those insults. Just as a warning, if you started it, I WILL edit your post to tone it down. This forum was not created to attack each other, regardless of what goes on outside here. We can discuss other websites, but we cannot be attacking each other if you want to be a member here.
Finally, Michael is right. I didn't get to see the information he posted over at Alipac, but if it's public information there is nothing anyone can do about it. However, it is in bad taste to do so here (or anywhere for that matter) and just as a future warning, anyone posting personal information about another member that shouldn't concern us in this forum will not be tolerated.
Thanks for the advice Dee, but whatever he does at another site will not be tolerated here. For the mean time, I like the way he's been able to comport himself and I can see some similarities that we have. Michael likes to laugh and that's good and I hope he can share with us some of his good laughter. I do hope that he does not think this forum is to bash immigrants (legal or not). While he is welcomed to share his opposing opinions, we do expect that he is able to share with us some positive opinions as well, especially in threads that remark on those positives that many immigrants (legal or not) have.
Now, this thread is about Xenophobia at Alipac and I agree that there are some who are quite extreme over there, but that's a never ending story. What I do worry about Alipac is that many are not able to speak up. Maybe they fear they will be banned? Whatever it is, I read somewhere that Alipac is a diverse crowd with some who are Hispanic. I find that hard to believe especially when there is so much Hispanic bashing going on over there. It's like someone saying Iamme's family is corrupt, thieves, good for nothings, blah blah blah's and I allow them to bash my family like that. If someone said that about your family and you know that some members in your family do not fit those discriptions, would you allow it to continue? Why is no one stopping this especially when they claim to have Hispanics in their group? The same goes for SOS. 
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MichaelC45
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Hi iammie,
I'm not here to bash immigrants and have no intention of doing so. My father was an immigrant who came here when he was 12.
I am all for legal immigration but these new bills being pushed through are nothing but a bandaid.
The government is responsible for the quota's on immigration and the law, and so far they have failed to keep up with either one. I don't blame the illegal immigrants for the mess we are in now, I blame the government, and untill we can get our government under control we should table alot of things and curtail more of their power untill they take responsibility for the jobs they are supposed to do.
They are legally in charge of overseeing the savings and loans but look what happened during the Clinton administration....... the savings and loans almost colapsed and they were supposed to be overseeing it......
I'm afraid before anyone should get serious about illegal immigrants in this country they need to show us they have an effective deturent in place at the border and not this tempory fix with the NG....
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iamme
Global Moderator
Hero Member
Posts: 1012
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Hi iammie,
I'm not here to bash immigrants and have no intention of doing so. My father was an immigrant who came here when he was 12.
I am all for legal immigration but these new bills being pushed through are nothing but a bandaid.
The government is responsible for the quota's on immigration and the law, and so far they have failed to keep up with either one. I don't blame the illegal immigrants for the mess we are in now, I blame the government, and untill we can get our government under control we should table alot of things and curtail more of their power untill they take responsibility for the jobs they are supposed to do.
They are legally in charge of overseeing the savings and loans but look what happened during the Clinton administration....... the savings and loans almost colapsed and they were supposed to be overseeing it......
I'm afraid before anyone should get serious about illegal immigrants in this country they need to show us they have an effective deturent in place at the border and not this tempory fix with the NG....
Well, it seems we're thinking along the same tracks. I also think that this is the governments fault for failing to enforce our immigration laws before this got out of hand. Now we have immigrants here who are without documentation and some have lived here so long they've nowhere else to go. It is understandable that many should have known that this could happen any day, but it should also be understandable that many of these undocumented immigrants were living in deplorable conditions back home, conditions not suitable for an adult, much less a child. So, while I am all for enforcing the laws and securing our borders, I also believe that we should also take into consideration that many of the undocumented immigrants have lived here and have established themselves here, and have in some form or another contributed to our society. I'm sure they can do more if only they were legalized. Yet, I understand why many think that this will only make the problem worse. The only reason it should become worse is if we don't enforce our immigration laws and if we don't revise our policies. Did you know that an immigrant that comes here to work only cannot travel outside of the United States, not even to see their families, unless it's an emergency? What options do we give an immigrant who is on a work visa who gets hurt outside the job? Where should they go and get assistance if they require a surgery but they're only getting paid $6.00 an hour? Maybe we should reform the law to allow immigrants on a worker's visa to be able to come and go as is needed? How about a family from another country who does not meet our immigrant family income guidelines in order to qualify? Should they suffer only because they are poor? Why not give them a chance to do something for themselves and their families? America spends millions on aids "giving" it to other countries in dire needs, and that's good, but why can't we allow others to come here and "work" for their maintance? Instead, we close the doors on them and wish them better luck next time in 10 years, but 10 years is too long to wait for many. The story goes on, but I'll cut it short and cut to the point. The undocumented immigrants are not pawns, and everyone is using them as such. The employers and the anti's. One wants to exploit them, the other wants to bash them and talks of them as if they are bags of trash that can just be "dumped" elsewhere (usually Mexico). I'm not seeing them as pawns, but as people with needs who are struggling to make a dream, a struggle we've long forgotten because many of us were'nt there when America started showing its roots. I know that there are many who don't deserve a chance at citizenship, or even a chance to work here, because they do all sorts of shit that it just makes our job all that much harder. But there are many many more who don't deserved to be pushed and pulled the way they are. I just want them out of the danger zone until everything can get resolved. IMHO, I say we should give them a pathway to citizenship/work, secure the borders, fine employers who thereafter continue to hire undocumented immigrants, and reform our immigration policies. Take care.
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Dee
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iamme,
he does pretend to be positive.
But lets not forget, he is the one who posted Tony´s personal information on the bizarro site.
He is the one who posted blatant information about this site there.
He pretends all he wants.
But people like Tweety and What Matters Most.. they are what they are.
But Tweety and WMM are too afraid too post here LOL.
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MichaelC45
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We are all being used as pawns....... What about the immigrant that is waiting to come here but can't because numbers are swelling and they have effectivly pushed back their acceptence.......
The government is only interested in one thing, and that is big business. Big business can't get the unions to lower wages so they move to another state and drop wages....... then as a few years go by and wages start to rise again, they pack up and leave to another country where they pay pennies on the dollar for a days wage......
Effective employer sanctions are nothing but a dream untill our government decides to really enforce the laws. They have the power to do it, but it they hit the goose that laid the golden egg for them, they themselves don't get reelcted..... I have lobbied in DC before and I have witnessed this first hand. Recent bills introduced to put more sanctions on employers have failed ..... so how do you control an out of control government? It surely isn't through more government and more regulations. We have an effective guest worker program but it has been seriously unattended and a lot of employers don't want to follow the rules because it would mean more expense for them, hence they would lose more money then they would have gained.
My first concern is to secure the borders. After that, our government needs to be held accountable for why they have not kept up with the immigration quota's. We also need to address the 12+ million people in this country that are out of work and the millions more that work two and three jobs just to make a living. IF you look deep into the stats at the labor bureau of labor statistics you will find that the 4% unemployment rate is really higher and they have manipulated the figures to show a low unemployment rate. The do not count people that have run out of benefits or people that went on government assistance.... or people that just gave up and live with family members........
I'll stop here since we have alot to chew on already lol......
Take care.
Michael
The undocumented immigrants are not pawns, and everyone is using them as such. The employers and the anti's. One wants to exploit them, the other wants to bash them and talks of them as if they are bags of trash that can just be "dumped" elsewhere (usually Mexico). I'm not seeing them as pawns, but as people with needs who are struggling to make a dream, a struggle we've long forgotten because many of us were'nt there when America started showing its roots. I know that there are many who don't deserve a chance at citizenship, or even a chance to work here, because they do all sorts of shit that it just makes our job all that much harder. But there are many many more who don't deserved to be pushed and pulled the way they are. I just want them out of the danger zone until everything can get resolved. IMHO, I say we should give them a pathway to citizenship/work, secure the borders, fine employers who thereafter continue to hire undocumented immigrants, and reform our immigration policies. Take care.
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bob1388
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iamme,
he does pretend to be positive.
But lets not forget, he is the one who posted Tony´s personal information on the bizarro site.
He is the one who posted blatant information about this site there.
He pretends all he wants.
But people like Tweety and What Matters Most.. they are what they are.
But Tweety and WMM are too afraid too post here LOL.
I share iamme's vision of this board where people can discuss without all the nastiness we've seen on other boards. Let's all rise above that and be nice.
Michael has promised to follow the rules. He deleted Tony's personal information on that 'other' site, and has not personally attacked anyone since I asked everyone to be more civil.
Let the past be the past, OK everyone?
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iamme
Global Moderator
Hero Member
Posts: 1012
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iamme,
he does pretend to be positive.
But lets not forget, he is the one who posted Tony´s personal information on the bizarro site.
He is the one who posted blatant information about this site there.
He pretends all he wants.
But people like Tweety and What Matters Most.. they are what they are.
But Tweety and WMM are too afraid too post here LOL.
Ah, tweet.  I remember her from another forum, but unfortunately I forgot my password to log on and didn't think it was worth going back to a forum where I am one and they are many, especially after the HB attack, I can imagine having ulcers at night. Don't get me wrong, Believe in America is not like the other anti-forums, and I really like it there despite the hassle, but when you're just butting heads constantly with the same people and no one is changing their minds, it's time to move on. I have a thing with not allowing posts to go unanswered, so when you have so many people jumping on you, it's hard to keep up, especially when you're working while you are doing it, and they just always had replies in much the same way as I. But I do remember Tweety, the one that claims that she's asked how Mexicans would feel if they were all of a sudden over run by Gringos. She claims no ones ever answered her, like her question is a good one, and that we never have a response. I answered her a long time ago much the same way as I will answer now, Mexicans would welcome them. Gringos are highly adored over there when they are not being snobs. They are treated better than their own gente, often allowing them into clubs for merely speaking English. Then again, nature has a way of taking it's course and turning this world inside out. I learned in my sociology class that sort of stuff, as to why we have hurricanes and earth quakes - it's nature way of keeping us from being over populated. The same things happen when colors change in countries. It's natures way of evening out our colors. Sure, many aren't going to like it, but nature is not a force to be reckoned with. One day this worlds will all be the same color and the same race. 
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Dee
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Iamme,
You are right. She constantly asks that questions and claims never to receive an answer. I´ve answered her several times. She just doesn´t like the answer.
You are right, there are many, many Americans that move to and live in Mexico. They speak English. Many Mexicans speak English too.
I shared the fact that I had a friend from Germany who was a Guest Worker. She was shocked that Americans only speak 1 language. She said in Europe most people speak many up to 6 languages quite fluently. She didn´t know why we try to restrict ourselves to only one language.
Ah, tweet. I remember her from another forum, but unfortunately I forgot my password to log on and didn't think it was worth going back to a forum where I am one and they are many, especially after the HB attack, I can imagine having ulcers at night. Don't get me wrong, Believe in America is not like the other anti-forums, and I really like it there despite the hassle, but when you're just butting heads constantly with the same people and no one is changing their minds, it's time to move on. I have a thing with not allowing posts to go unanswered, so when you have so many people jumping on you, it's hard to keep up, especially when you're working while you are doing it, and they just always had replies in much the same way as I. But I do remember Tweety, the one that claims that she's asked how Mexicans would feel if they were all of a sudden over run by Gringos. She claims no ones ever answered her, like her question is a good one, and that we never have a response. I answered her a long time ago much the same way as I will answer now, Mexicans would welcome them. Gringos are highly adored over there when they are not being snobs. They are treated better than their own gente, often allowing them into clubs for merely speaking English. Then again, nature has a way of taking it's course and turning this world inside out. I learned in my sociology class that sort of stuff, as to why we have hurricanes and earth quakes - it's nature way of keeping us from being over populated. The same things happen when colors change in countries. It's natures way of evening out our colors. Sure, many aren't going to like it, but nature is not a force to be reckoned with. One day this worlds will all be the same color and the same race. |
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Dee
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Bob,
You are right.
The only reason I brought up the other issue was due to the post about Tony´s personal information being posted.
Now that he was forced to take it down, and he took it down, I will not speak of it again.
Tony.. I´m glad we could help in ensuring that your personal info was taken down. :-)
I share iamme's vision of this board where people can discuss without all the nastiness we've seen on other boards. Let's all rise above that and be nice.
Michael has promised to follow the rules. He deleted Tony's personal information on that 'other' site, and has not personally attacked anyone since I asked everyone to be more civil.
Let the past be the past, OK everyone?
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bob1388
Guest
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Now, getting back on topic, did everyone get a chance to read the excellent report "Americans for Legal Immigration (ALI-PAC):
Xenophobia, Nativism and Anti-Immigrant Hysteria"?
http://www.buildingdemocracy.org/ali-pac.pdf
The author did a fantastic job of researching ALI-PAC, it's President, and the cast of other characters, some of them avowed white supramacists.
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MichaelC45
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I wasn't forced to take it down...... I volunterally took it down.........
So now that is straightened up lets move on please.......... 
Michael
Bob, You are right. The only reason I brought up the other issue was due to the post about Tony´s personal information being posted. Now that he was forced to take it down, and he took it down, I will not speak of it again. Tony.. I´m glad we could help in ensuring that your personal info was taken down. :-) I share iamme's vision of this board where people can discuss without all the nastiness we've seen on other boards. Let's all rise above that and be nice.
Michael has promised to follow the rules. He deleted Tony's personal information on that 'other' site, and has not personally attacked anyone since I asked everyone to be more civil.
Let the past be the past, OK everyone?
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